Styleswitching for Accessibility
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Are CSS Styleswitchers for accessibility support needed in addition to users' native browser features?
Yes
42%
[ 8 ]
No
36%
[ 7 ]
In specific cases
21%
[ 4 ]
Total Votes : 19
Colleagues, I have a question I'd like your opinion on:
Do users really need style options delivered through a stylesheet switcher in additon to the native accessibility features of their browser or user agent? Context for this question: online store (user and admin interfaces).
My view has come round to almost deciding that I will support access with solid html structure that will not inhibit users from changing the presentation using native features. However, outside the presentation that I apply with access in mind, if users have more specific presentation requirements they should use their own user agent features to achieve it. If this has been covered in detail and I've missed it, apologies and please point out the thread and feel free to delete this one.
All votes, thoughts and experiences gratefully recieved.
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Jon Tan, Grow Collective
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Jon,
Good question. It has been discussed before although I'd like to see the results of a straw poll. One thing though. I have a problem with the word "need" in your poll question. I would be reluctant to say that "users need" stylesheet switchers but I still think they are a good idea for a lot of users and we plan to add one to the CFIT site when we have time. I also have a problem with the word "users". Do you mean "a lot of users", "some users", "enough users"? Maybe if you change the poll question to "Are stylesheet switchers useful enough to make them a good idea?" I will be able to vote.
Sorry if this sounds pedantic to some people. It's not meant to be.
_________________
Dr. Mark Magennis
Director, Centre for Inclusive Technology
National Council for the blind of Ireland
www.cfit.ie
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if you use the word need i would say no
whilst they might be very useful they would not be needed if the pages are well made ( in the terms of accessibility and usability ) imho
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Hi Mark,
Someone has voted so it would be unfair to change the goalposts although perhaps some clarification is required.
The question is about need in so much as the majority of user agents have good native accessibility features therefore is there an actual need for switchers?
If our colleagues think yes, there is a need, then outside of the poll question, I'm interested in the context in which that would apply and the need a switcher would address. The question related to online stores but any specific opinion for any context would be welcome. We are considering depracating the stylesheet switcher functionality or at least making it optional so I'm hoping to get opinions in that context and others.
_________________
Jon Tan, Grow Collective
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I have a problem with the word "needed" here. Style switchers can be useful if done correctly, but that doesn't mean they are needed._________________
Red Ant
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I'm with most people on this one. If the original stylesheet is good enough, they aren't needed. They might still be nice to include if you can, though
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I agree that they are not needed if the HTML and CSS presentation are good enough. I also agree they can be useful though. Maybe it's useful to start with a baseline set of assumptions:- The developer / designer checks their work thoroughly and/or submits it for further tips from Accessify forum
- HTML is accessible
- CSS presents the content well for generic accessibility
_________________
Jon Tan, Grow Collective
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Colour switching?
The trouble is unless you know how to activate the different options in your browser you're stuck. I quick simple link on a website makes it a little more straightforward.
_________________
Red Ant
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| JonTan wrote: |
| If our colleagues think yes, there is a need, then outside of the poll question, I'm interested in the context in which that would apply and the need a switcher would address. |
As I see it, the main need addressed by a switcher is that of users who don't know how to configure (and/or adjust on the fly) their user agent/operating system to make web pages more readable for them. This is a very real need for many users. So real and so many users that I think it is very worthwhile thinking about incorporating a style switcher on a site. The need will remain until either the user agent configurability becomes patently obvious to all new (and many existing) users or they all receive training/education/mentoring/help that teaches them how to do it easily and effectively. An alternative that I think is bound to happen but perhaps not for a while and in a piecemeal way, is that configuration will be done automatically for the user according to a "personal needs and preferences profile" that is stored on their machine or in some central digital identity server or on their personal identity card ("papers" as they used to be known in WWII
). Until that happens, my view is that configuration functionality should be obvious and upfront in the user agents, instead of being hidden within some "accessibility" dialog that you have to go to some control panel to find.
Mark
_________________
Dr. Mark Magennis
Director, Centre for Inclusive Technology
National Council for the blind of Ireland
www.cfit.ie
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| DRem wrote: |
| As I see it, the main need addressed by a switcher is that of users who don't know how to configure (and/or adjust on the fly) their user agent/operating system to make web pages more readable for them. This is a very real need for many users. So real and so many users that I think it is very worthwhile thinking about incorporating a style switcher on a site. The need will remain until either the user agent configurability becomes patently obvious to all new (and many existing) users or they all receive training/education/mentoring/help that teaches them how to do it easily and effectively. |
i do resent that we as web content developers are, as ever, supposed to shoulder the problems caused by the user agent developers not bothering with making their controls more readily and obviously available *by default*. a banal example would be the text resize button in IE: it's in the application, and it can be made visible in the toolbar via View > Toolbars > Customise ... but why the heck not make that button visible from the start? it would at least reduce the number of users who didn't even know they could resize the text. on a related note, that button could also benefit from being a bit more obvious visually ( and yes, maybe along the lines of my firefox text size toolbar extension http://www.splintered.co.uk/... ).
| Quote: |
| An alternative that I think is bound to happen but perhaps not for a while and in a piecemeal way, is that configuration will be done automatically for the user according to a "personal needs and preferences profile" that is stored on their machine or in some central digital identity server or on their personal identity card |
or it could be stored on a small USB drive that they can then take with them and plug into any PC that would support the scheme. some interesting stuff happening along those lines with ACCLIP http://www.imsglobal.org/... in an e-learning context. i'd also see ACCLIP working in combination with something like the Composite Capability/Preferences Profile (CC/PP) http://www.w3.org/...
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Patrick H. Lauke / webmaster / University of Salford
co-lead: WaSP Accesibility Task Force
take it to the streets ... WaSP Street Team
personal: splintered | photographia | redux
co-author: Web Accessibility - Web Standards and Regulatory Compliance
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This is a sweet style switcher used by the uk film council:
www.ukfilmcouncil.org.uk/customise/
What is it with Yellow, White and Black backgrounds?
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Johan De Silva / Portfolio | Place of Work @Flipside | Read my movie reviews punk!
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| Johan007 wrote: |
| This is a sweet style switcher used by the uk film council:
www.ukfilmcouncil.org.uk/customise/ What is it with Yellow, White and Black backgrounds? |
I'm not sure if you were being ironic because that switcher does not work at all without javascript turned on and the, 'text only' link is not found. The same functionality can be achieved on the server side with no javascript used at all.
_________________
Jon Tan, Grow Collective
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| Johan007 wrote: |
| This is a sweet style switcher used by the uk film council:
www.ukfilmcouncil.org.uk/customise/ |
shame it relies solely on javascript...
_________________
Patrick H. Lauke / webmaster / University of Salford
co-lead: WaSP Accesibility Task Force
take it to the streets ... WaSP Street Team
personal: splintered | photographia | redux
co-author: Web Accessibility - Web Standards and Regulatory Compliance
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That's a task for alternative CSS sheets but the idea never took off properly._________________
};-) http://www.xhtmlcoder.com/
WVYFC chose the Yorkshire Air Ambulance as the main charity to fund raise for in 2006
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My vote goes to 'in specific cases', the thinking being that it might be a courtesy to provide one if only for the sake of IE/Win users if using px units to size text.
To some large degree, I'm content to let more discerning browser users learn about and use the functionality built into their browser rather than duplicate aspects of its functionality just to place it right under the users' noses.
(I deplore the extent to which the 'don't make me think' mindset feels developers/authors should go to fawningly save users the trouble of using their grey matter for anything other than eating and breathing.)
</moanyoldgit>
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